Everything DrAwkward said! So glad to be a part of the journey with you, dude!

I told my younger self that I wanted to be in bands and make albums in my adult life, which I did. I feel really good about what I've done and didn't sacrifice what was important to me to do it. I'm content with switching things up, making music with my friends in my home and have music around for my kids. I don' t have the desire to go on tours or play out anymore, but I still wanna make music!

jason from volo wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 12:54 am

A_Man_Who_Tries wrote: Sun Jul 25, 2021 12:30 am

ErikG wrote: Sat Jul 24, 2021 3:48 pm Don’t join bands. Find people and start a band.

Took twenty years to figure that out.

I'm stealing that. Well put.

This MIGHT be the only thing or at least the main thing I’ve done right since 1994.

Good people can get better at instruments. Good musicians that are assholes seem to have a tougher time becoming non-assholes.

< edit > I realize after reading this that I may have missed the point slightly. Or maybe I didn’t. Start bands with friends, don’t join bands with people you don’t know? < / edit >

I wouldn't say you missed the point, in fact your interpretation is at least as valid as what I intended. Learning to play together with fellow non-musician friends is probably how many of us got started.

What I intended was the importance of 'getting in on the ground floor' vs. joining an ongoing endeavor.

Over the years some of my very cool and talented friends have been in bands in need of a bass player. I play bass, these are great people, I like the music, and they are open to co-write/collaborate. Awesome.

But after a while what seemed like a good fit at first felt limiting and uninspiring. Arrangement and writing would adhere to 'what this band is about'. Felt like I was in Someone Else's Band.

Now this probably has more to do with my own expectations and quirks. Plenty of people happily step into existing bands.

But for me establishing a foundation together with like-minded individuals is the way to go.

The most important thing to me in the long arc of doing this stuff, is learning how to manage ego and expectations.

Don't get me wrong, I never thought that I was King Shit, or that my band was about to get signed to Subpop. But there's this weird zen you can reach as an independent musician where you simultaneously promote recordings and shows, without caring too much about record sales/streams, or concert attendance. It's that space where you say, "It'd be cool if a bunch of people come. If not it's fine. I'm just lucky to play." The weird combination of crafting something well, putting some energy into making it available, and then limiting concern about if it lands. It's a hard enough tight rope that I more often under promote, and don't give things the hustle they might deserve because it's still better than promoting exhaustively and then being too focused on an abstract and uncontrollable outcome.

In my 20's I wasted a lot of energy on desire for big crowds. Part of it was being spoiled by the 90's. There was a time when you could start a band that sounds like a second rate Screeching Weasel, play a few shows, put out a tape and find yourself playing in front of 200 kids who would sing along. I've seen a lot of friends get really lost in bitterness, say embarassing things, and take stuff out on their band members because they're looking for that groundswell of attention, and feel resentment that it's not coming.

As an aging member of the local scene, I've observed how the majority of my friends are ironically creating stuff that is infinitely better from an artistic perspective and playing it to smaller audiences. This all gels with something everyone should keep in mind when they get in to doing it: music is not a meritocracy. Otherwise a list of bands who worked their asses off and had good distribution/major label backing in the late 90's would have been huge.

After doing it a million times, the craft of songwriting and arranging is so much clearer to me, and it's now the most satisfying part. It may have always been, but other things might have distracted from that. I feel that same "if I was your age" sense that while I only have time in life for one ongoing project at a time, if I were in my early 20's I could contribute much more to a variety of groups reflecting my passion and understanding for a variety of genres. Sometimes when I'm listening to Minor Threat, or Fela Kuti, or Bedhead, or The Damned I think, "Man, it'd be cool to do a side project kind of like this." If only there was more time.

if playing your own music gets boring and leads to arguments but the band starts having a blast when you just start jamming on Descendents or Ramones songs, just go ahead and do that. who fucking cares?

stop doing everything as a means to an end.

When I was in my early 20s I got kicked out of a band for dumb reasons unrelated to music which were partly my fault. I really loved what we were doing and was kind of devastated. I moved to a different city just in time for its local punk rock scene to flower. I actively participated but was still too humiliated by my experience to start a band.

Eventually the scene burned itself out. A few years later a new group of kids got the rock revved up again. One day a local musician a decade younger than me who I didn't know very well said "Hey, you're a guitarist. I've got a few ideas, let's jam." After a couple false starts we got a real good band going.

Today this guy is one of my best friends and we've been playing and touring and recording music for 15 years. We've had some crazy adventures. It's been up and down but mostly a blast. During COVID we wrote about 30 songs together and cranked out 4 track demos for all of them in our living room.

Now that I'm in my 50s I guess I'm making up for lost time.

akosinski wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 9:39 am if playing your own music gets boring and leads to arguments but the band starts having a blast when you just start jamming on Descendents or Ramones songs, just go ahead and do that. who fucking cares?

stop doing everything as a means to an end.

I did once fill in on bass for a covers band who specialized in 60s garage punk and freakbeat tunes (which was right up my alley), but this was because their regular bass player had had to take some time out from the band due to illness. It was indeed a blast, but it was always understood by both parties that my membership was only ever going to be temporary. I've since had a few informal jams with them though and it's always been fun due to the lack of pressure.