Ribbon mics: I don't know shit about 'em.

Recently, I've heard some recordings using ribbons as overheads (TheSwede RULES.) The difference between them and condensers was astounding.

I'm thinking about investing in a few ribbon mics but I'd like to know more about them.

-What makes them "so great"?

-How should they be treated/stored? I know they're sensitive...

-What sources should I avoid recording with a ribbon?

-Should I be using specific pres, compressors, etc.?

I'm sure there is a wealth of information at my feet if I were to UTFSF, but hopefully there are other idiots out there like me that can benefit from one condensed thread dedicated to ribbon mics.

MajorEverettMiller wrote:.
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I'm sure there is a wealth of information at my feet if I were to UTFSF, but hopefully there are other idiots out there like me that can benefit from one condensed thread dedicated to ribbon mics.

So right!

MajorEverettMiller wrote:-What makes them "so great"?

-How should they be treated/stored? I know they're sensitive...

-What sources should I avoid recording with a ribbon?

-Should I be using specific pres, compressors, etc.?

I think the Swede has some M160s, doesn't he?

Ribbons are "so great" for a few reasons. They firstly generally have a smooth frequency response without any sharp peaks or troughs, so they tend not to accentuate any particular frequencies. Their frequency response tails off relatively slowly in the high-end - this will start to happen between 10K or 18K usually. This is partly what gives them their "smooth" sound. Their transient response (eg. response to the initial attack of a sound) is faster than most other mics as a result of having a very low-mass diaphragm - this makes them more accurate. Also, they avoid the transient distortion which can affect condenser mics. As a result of all of this, they can be quite realistic sounding compared to other mics with hyped frequency responses.

Treat them like children - give them a smack around the....

No, no, treat them carefully. Keep them dry and away from any gusts of air. There was a thread about ribbon orientation in storage recently, but I wouldn't worry about that too much.

I'd avoid recording kick drum, snare drum, toms, bass guitar, or anything which pushes out air. Having said that, I've heard of people use ribbons on all of these sources. Also, they don't sound great on everything. They can be a bit dull or wooly on some sources.

A quiet preamp with plenty of gain is a good thing. People argue about what load impedance ribbons like to see in a preamp, but I'd just use your ears and decide what you think is best. Try for at least 66dB gain, but you'll probably get away with 60dB for most sources.

Aye, the M160's are great overheads... they have really helped me drum recordings.

The thing i love about ribbons, is the fact that you need to push them... in the sense that they work amazing on loud sources, but they can be almost too damn quiet on them quiet instruments.

The M160's are different then other ribbon mics i have used however, as they are cardioid patterned, and apart from other beyer mics, i have not seen this so much. As the Royers and AEA (the other ribbon mic i have some experience with) are figure 8, which is a very different pick up pattern to deal with in the case of drum overheads.

The AEA R84 is a great mic as well, though the first time i got a chance to mess with them, my friend and i had no idea what the deal was with them. We were trying to record some acoustic guitars and just could not get them loud enough. I have since gone back and listened to those tracks we recorded and have come to realize that those mics were just friggin' incredible, and we were just too inexperienced to make good use of them at the time.

I had later tried out those Nady ribbon mics, and was thoroughly disappointed, as they just sounded so damn ugly on most of the sources i tried them on... they had none of the character that the R84's had. So those are not worth the trouble.

I would say again though major, that a pair of M160's are an ideal set of Overhead mics... I actually position them more or less slightly above my own head from behind the kit and pointing toward the Hat and Ride in a spaced pair. They have always done me right, as far as cutting down those damn high transients.

They run cheaper than them there Royers and them there AEA's as well. About $600, as opposed to $1000, or so.

Pants.

DefinitelyNOTtheSWEDE wrote:Aye, the M160's are great overheads... they have really helped me drum recordings.

...

The M160's are different then other ribbon mics i have used however, as they are cardioid patterned, and apart from other beyer mics, i have not seen this so much. As the Royers and AEA (the other ribbon mic i have some experience with) are figure 8, which is a very different pick up pattern to deal with in the case of drum overheads.

...

I would say again though major, that a pair of M160's are an ideal set of Overhead mics... I actually position them more or less slightly above my own head from behind the kit and pointing toward the Hat and Ride in a spaced pair. They have always done me right, as far as cutting down those damn high transients.

They run cheaper than them there Royers and them there AEA's as well. About $600, as opposed to $1000, or so.

Pants.

I haven't used an M160 for instruments, but it a fantastic vocal mic. The transparency of the mic really makes it fun to sing into. It feels like a natural extension of your singing.

I've sang/recorded into maybe 20-25 vocal mics in my limited recording history (some low grade, some high-- Shure, Oktava (quality kind/gtr center kind) , AT, Neumann, AKG, Rode, etc.) and I flipped out over singing into the Beyer when Orion (recorder) got it midway through the session. it rules. I went and redid all my vocal parts, just in case. one of these years when I start buying recording gear again, I'd pick up a matched pair, seguro.


very recommended.

I just got a ShinyBox 23 as my first ribbon mic and I can't say enough good things about it. Get one.

this might have been said, but should be emphasized...
DON'T DON'T DON'T use phantom power!

And about cheap ribbon mic...
Does anyone know what the thing about T-bones ribbon mic (RM700 / RB500)? Are they a good way to introduce the ribon mic world at an affordable price, or are they just peaces of shit???

McNoodles, those T-bones and such are actually the same mic as the Nady, which is i suppose fine in some regards, but i certainly did not like it... too harsh it seemed.

However, the shinybox mics which i think are the same basic ribbon element as those (they seem to all come from a chinese manufacturer, hence the fact that they are everywhere and under all sorts of different names...), yet they replace the transformers and such (making them sound much better then version i had...). And them's is certainly not too damn expensive, even for the best of their line:

http://www.shinybox.com/ShinyBox23.php? ... 9e7d3f87bb

Oh yeah, and do be very careful about the phantom power... you will can destroy the ribbon that way...

For me the first time i used a ribbon mic, i was really expecting to have struck gold from all i had heard about them, and the adoration that hip engineers and Albini enthusiasts had put out there. The truth was, they are pretty Dull sounding and very quiet to ears trained on over hyped and cost efficient condenser mics. It took some settling down and time for me to truly understand what they can do well, and most of it was because i was so used to my one "nice" large condenser, and the rest of the mics i had. For me, it was the first time i swapped out my C-1000's for the Beyer pair that blew me away. The C1000's just seemed to have a more harsh sheen to them, with the treble peaks being just damn ugly. i was really trying for a tight "seventies" (that make sense to anyone but me?) sorta sound... the condensers, even brought down, were ok, but just not "warm" or particularly pleasant sounding.

The ribbons, however, were just the ticket. The meters barely registered when tapped them (gently), and they seemed like they could be too quiet before i put on the headphones and hit record. They were perfect for my ears though, this sort of need for them to be driven was perfect for drum overheads in my case, because there was just too much signal coming from the condensers before. And the "dullness" i mentioned, was not that at all, just a more accurate, less "studio-hyped" high end that finally made my cymbals sound like, well, fucking cymbals and not glass breaking.

In the right conditions, they are just the bomb on acoustic guitars... that high "sqweek", and pick sound are smoothed over just right as well.

For the poor lil home studio dude, ribbons and a RNLA are things that i feel i have wisely spent my dough on.

get the best ribbons you can afford, and you know, sacrifice a lil if necessary to do so, they will never be a microphone you regretted buying, even years on.

Yes... but shiny box are not provided in Europe... rats!

McNoodles from Josh wrote:Yes... but shiny box are not provided in Europe... rats!

Yes they are. Just send an email to Ju, and ask for a shipping quotation. He is a nice guy and accepts Paypal and credit cards.