dipshit jigaboo wrote:Also, Before Bush invaded two of their neighboring states and called them evil (and other dumbass saber-ratting), they were on a path towards a more West-friendly democracy.

More farcical still was the inclusion of N. Korea in the "axis of evil." N. Korea was to the axis of evil as Poland was to the coalition of the willing.

Neil Smith wrote:In order to enhance the impression that nasty dictators with WMDs were the real rationale for war, and this was not just a war against Arabs or Muslims, North Korea was hastily given a proud place in the axis. [This] emboldened a defeated and decrepit Pyonggyang regime to defy the US, assert they did indeed have nuclear ingredients and so what, and then openly offer and demand a non-aggression pact. An embarrassed US was flipped the finger, had no real response, but had to mop up an unneeded distraction. US allies in South Korea, meanwhile, were livid. Not only did the axis of evil suddenly present the prospect of new conflict on the Korean peninsula, but it abruptly re-empowered the North and scuttled an impending leveraged buyout by South Korea[my emphasis]

Did you know:

-- the US military is the world's 11th largest economy, its expenditures surpass those of the next 15 nations combined, and its budget exceeds the entire GDP of India?

-- the Bush administration formally announced that the US no longer supports several key aspects of the 1970 Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty

-- the Bush administration is opposed to the Anti-Ballistic Missile Treaty and the Comprehensive Test Ban Treaty

-- the Clinton administration made a mockery of international attempts to ban chemical and biological weapons by establishing a separate set of rules for the US at the Chemical Weapons Convention (1997)

-- Khrushchev called for a mutual reduction of military forces and armaments. The Eisenhower administration ignored this, but Khrushchev implemented reduced military spending unilaterally over the objections of his military command

-- the Kennedy administration also knew about Khrushchev's reductions and his call for reciprocity, but charged ahead (despite being well ahead in the race) and undertook the largest peace-time military build-up in world history (effectively terminating Khrushchev's reformist project)


Trouble with Iran meanwhile, is that it’s a threat to international peace and security.



[quote"Carnival of Souls"] personally could give a shit about the Middle East.[/quote]


Hey, Carnival of Souls, what places on earth do you give a shit about?

One good reason for for giving shit is that if we live in one of the member countries of the Coalition of the Living, a portion of any taxes we pay sponsors our governments' military expenditure, whether we like it or not. This puts some kind of moral obligation on us to give a shit. Might not be fair, but there you go.

The more I read, the more disillusioned I become about our political classes, and the more convinced I become that I have to read more to reach informed opinions. Politics disgusts me, but it is important.

EDIT: I meant to write "Coalition of the Willing", but I'll keep my mistake in as it gives me the spooks.

Andrew L., what's Dubai like? A leftist writer friend of mine was there recently to give a brief creative writing course for young local women. He found his class to be very intelligent, mischievous and imaginative, but when I asked him about the place itself, he started muttering darkly under his breath about "shopping, beaches and drunk expats in hotel bars."

Andrew L. wrote: Hey, Carnival of Souls, what places on earth do you give a shit about?

What is it to you? I loathe Islamic fundamentalists on principle who have nothing but contempt for Western society as a whole. I have no desire to visit the Middle East and it is my prerogative to not give a shit about them if I want to. I work hard, mind my own business and do what ever I want to.

I think the US should deliver Iran some of our own nuclear technology.

jlamour wrote:I think the US should deliver Iran some of our own nuclear technology.

Maybe there's an Iranian Jonathan Pollard already doing that. According to the 9/11 Commission, US intelligence is sloppy and misdirected ( especially when useful people attract their suspicion )...

sparky wrote:Andrew L., what's Dubai like? A leftist writer friend of mine was there recently to give a brief creative writing course for young local women. He found his class to be very intelligent, mischievous and imaginative, but when I asked him about the place itself, he started muttering darkly under his breath about "shopping, beaches and drunk expats in hotel bars."

That sounds about right. But then, I've never been to Dubai.

Guess I should change that business beneath my avatar (which doesn't much resemble me).

Meanwhile, I totally agree with you about hating "politics," Sparky. Either one takes an interest in it that abstracts events and processes from their human consequences (risking losing the point), or one oscillates between crippling despair and militant anger.

I also agree that citizens should take responsibility for their government's actions and policies. We need to stop whinging about gov't accountability and become accountable ourselves--to acknowledge that our lives and livelihoods are part of a global web of relations that includes the heinous things enacted or ignored by our representatives. Such accountability would be revolutionary, of course. But, hey.

Carnival of Souls wrote:

Andrew L. wrote: Hey, Carnival of Souls, what places on earth do you give a shit about?

What is it to you? I loathe Islamic fundamentalists on principle who have nothing but contempt for Western society as a whole. I have no desire to visit the Middle East and it is my prerogative to not give a shit about them if I want to. I work hard, mind my own business and do what ever I want to.

christ talk about having your head in the sand!

Sarnival of Couls wrote:

Andrew L. wrote: Hey, Sarnival of Couls, what places on earth do you give a shit about?

What is it to you? I loathe <Christian Right> fundamentalists on principle who have nothing but contempt for <Women's rights, homosexuals, public education, voluntary euthanasia, premarital sex> as a whole. I have no desire to visit the <people who want to die in comfort, impregnated rape victims, San Francisco, the Middle East> and it is my prerogative to not give a shit about them if I want to. I <pray> hard, <believe I live in a theocracy> and do what ever I want to.

Carnival of Souls wrote:Also, Islamic, fundamental extremists bother me more than anything else.

How many, sir, Islamic fundamentalist extremists do you encounter on a daily basis? I am a teacher; I see elementary students every day. What bothers me more than anything else is seeing disadvantaged, minority, low-SES children struggle daily to compete with suburban white kids. More than anything else.

I apologize if you live in Afghanistan and try to make it a more Western-friendly place daily, as a career. Otherwise, you need to turn off Fox News - it make you so brainwashy.

(I put this in the USA thread, and I'm putting it here too.)

Okay, when a person gets an "ass-kicking," maybe it means maybe he learns a lesson, gets a little negative reinforcement, maybe some humility, a couple bruises, whatever. When a country gets an "ass-kicking" it means lots of human beings become not alive anymore. Please, no "ass-kickings" for countries, please. It is very easy to forget about the part where people who were alive are made not alive, by calling it by the quick and easy name of "ass-kicking," but please remember what this really is. Also, giving a country an "ass-kicking" doesn't really do any good in the long run, usually. There are some exceptions. In WWII, the axis was actually trying to take over the world, and they did get a well-deserved "ass-kicking," and that was good, but please remember also that Germany wouldn't have even tried such a thing if they hadn't gotten such an "ass-kicking" a couple decades previous. Trouble in the middle east? Communism in China? Instability in Africa? Terrorist attacks against the West/the USA? You can trace it all back to some time somebody decided, hey, somebody needs an "ass-kicking."

I don't know for sure what the solution is, but I know an "ass-kicking" is just more problem.