twelvepoint wrote: Thu Jan 05, 2023 4:09 pm I've been experimenting with drum tuning lately and wanted to get toms with a little more bounce. So naturally I tuned up the top heads tighter than normal. But to keep a little body to the drum, I lowered the pitch on the reso heads. There's a perfect 4th between the bottom (lower) and top (higher) heads. That sounded decent in the room, but when recording the top head tom mics were emphasized and a little pingy. So I moved the tom mics to the underside. Combined with what the overheads are getting, I could live with a sound like that, and bounce playing on the toms feels good and records well.

Yeah.. that sort of bop tuning (tighter top than bottom) came about before (conventional) close mic'ing was a thing, so blending some extra resonance only makes sense. Do you find yourself flipping phase on any of them?

I do like the rebound of bop tuning but it sounds ridiculous on anything I play. And at best I can fake jazz on a good day, maybe I need to go watch Whiplash again..

penningtron wrote: Fri Jan 06, 2023 8:59 am

twelvepoint wrote: Thu Jan 05, 2023 4:09 pm I've been experimenting with drum tuning lately and wanted to get toms with a little more bounce. So naturally I tuned up the top heads tighter than normal. But to keep a little body to the drum, I lowered the pitch on the reso heads. There's a perfect 4th between the bottom (lower) and top (higher) heads. That sounded decent in the room, but when recording the top head tom mics were emphasized and a little pingy. So I moved the tom mics to the underside. Combined with what the overheads are getting, I could live with a sound like that, and bounce playing on the toms feels good and records well.

Yeah.. that sort of bop tuning (tighter top than bottom) came about before (conventional) close mic'ing was a thing, so blending some extra resonance only makes sense. Do you find yourself flipping phase on any of them?

I do like the rebound of bop tuning but it sounds ridiculous on anything I play. And at best I can fake jazz on a good day, maybe I need to go watch Whiplash again..

Yeah I did have to flip phase on the tom mics, which added a lot of lower end.

I'm not a jazz person either, but I do like that ginger baker/proto-metal/krautrock stuff where there's still some big band influence in tuning and approach. At the same time, I don't want toms that sound like timbales. So yeah I kinda went down that bop tuning rabbit hole (also my kit is 12/14/20, so might at well!).

It's kinda fun to have drums where I can do bounce stuff on toms and not sound like the rebound stroke is just mud. Kinda opens up some possibilities i guess?

twelvepoint wrote: Fri Jan 06, 2023 10:28 am I do like that ginger baker/proto-metal/krautrock stuff where there's still some big band influence in tuning and approach. At the same time, I don't want toms that sound like timbales.

I had to get honest with myself about the floor tom especially.. the bop thing just sounds ridiculous to me there. I recently put coated G2s on both sides and tuned them both 'medium'. No more funny ringing or trampoline feel.

penningtron wrote: Fri Jan 06, 2023 10:41 am

twelvepoint wrote: Fri Jan 06, 2023 10:28 am I do like that ginger baker/proto-metal/krautrock stuff where there's still some big band influence in tuning and approach. At the same time, I don't want toms that sound like timbales.

I had to get honest with myself about the floor tom especially.. the bop thing just sounds ridiculous to me there. I recently put coated G2s on both sides and tuned them both 'medium'. No more funny ringing or trampoline feel.

if one of you fools has any tips on tuning floor toms to make them not sound like shit I have open ears cause I've tried everything. by ear, robot tuners, weird tune out the wrinkles shit... I can't get a floor tom to ever sound good.

Kniferide wrote: Fri Jan 06, 2023 3:31 pm

penningtron wrote: Fri Jan 06, 2023 10:41 am

twelvepoint wrote: Fri Jan 06, 2023 10:28 am I do like that ginger baker/proto-metal/krautrock stuff where there's still some big band influence in tuning and approach. At the same time, I don't want toms that sound like timbales.

I had to get honest with myself about the floor tom especially.. the bop thing just sounds ridiculous to me there. I recently put coated G2s on both sides and tuned them both 'medium'. No more funny ringing or trampoline feel.

if one of you fools has any tips on tuning floor toms to make them not sound like shit I have open ears cause I've tried everything. by ear, robot tuners, weird tune out the wrinkles shit... I can't get a floor tom to ever sound good.

I (too) moved to a 14" FT a few years ago and that helped, but still wasn't enough. The best thing I've currently come up with is using the same top/bottom heads (minimum 10 mil heads on both sides) tuned as close as possible, and even then I went with Evans coated on both because those sound a little more controlled to me. I think that minimized the dropping off the cliff 'BAOowww' sound without going completely dead.

I'm no tuning pro but I do get a good sound out of my floor tom. Low as I can go without being floppy, tune both heads about the same, maybe a little tighter on the bottom head, and replace the feet with Pearl Air Rides.
https://www.long-mcquade.com/4172/Drums ... 3_Pack.htm

A few loose cotton balls on the inside of the drum can help with the basketball ping, though I also feel like that's a thing that's not really an issue in the real world and kind of easy to EQ out in recording. I've also seen some videos of folks using thin pieces of fabric hung inside the drum itself (but not touching the heads) to tone down the side-to-side reflections that maybe exacerbate the ping, but I've never tried that myself.

I'm also a recent and absolute convert to the inexpensive set-and-forget evans torque key. Highly rec'd for all drummers who would prefer to not think of tuning drums as some sort of weird alchemical relationship to a cylinder of wood.

Those air ride floor tom feets are supposed to be cool, I keep meaning to grab some next time I buy sticks.

Coated heads on top are helpful. Medium tension, close to the same pitch top and bottom. Every drum seems to have a pitch it likes best so I usually try a little higher, little lower and see where it wants to sit.

I also find that in isolation a tom that broadcasts a clear note with a little sustain sounds kind of goofy, but in the context of the kit and moreso a mix of guitars it can be more assertive than whatever dry thud that sounds cooler alone.

Oh yes seconded on coated heads, I forgot that but all my toms are coated

losthighway wrote: Fri Jan 06, 2023 5:14 pm Coated heads on top are helpful. Medium tension, close to the same pitch top and bottom. Every drum seems to have a pitch it likes best so I usually try a little higher, little lower and see where it wants to sit.

I agree with working with what the drum likes. My drums can get choked if I try and take them outside the sweet spot.

Personally I like tuning the bottom head a 4th higher than the top (though I recently reversed that, see above). For me, the perfect intervals seem to work ok if I don’t tune unison.