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Support it?

Yes
Total votes: 30 (68%)
No
Total votes: 14 (32%)
Total votes: 44

Illegal Immigration?

11 by yaledelay_Archive
while I really do not support closed boarders there is a problem that many people who "support immigration" do not bring up, and that is that by letting people into our country to do the jobs at the lowest run of the pole we have effectively created a caste/slave system, these people do not receive the wages americans do, they do not receive the "healthcare" americans do, they can not unionize. As a matter of fact I know of a few cases where some of my illeagle friends have had there employers threaten to call immigration on them.

So I can say that while I have no problem with those people being here, I do think they might be hurting themselves in the long run, and also hurting the public by driving the de-facto min wage down... I have no clue what the solution is though, I wish there was a good one...
Ty Webb wrote:
You need to stop pretending that this is some kind of philosophical choice not to procreate and just admit you don't wear pants to the dentist.

Illegal Immigration?

13 by joelb_Archive
BREAKING THE LAW! BREAKING THE LAW!

I wish I could remember where I read it. It was perhaps on this message board. The hypocrisy in the use of the term "illegal" as a reason for ostracizing these folks is stunning. "They have broken the law, and must be punished." What the fuck ever. Now that that idiotic debate is out the window, the reasons at the heart of most arguments against illegal immigration are 1) rule of law - bullshit, see above 2) bleeding tax dollars without contributing, e.g. at hospitals. I have yet to see any peer-reviewed research that suggests this is the case, but please provide if it's out there 3) burdening teachers with students who don't speak English (related to #2, of course) and 4) racism. Even if #2 was true, I'd bet dollars to donuts that the contributions of illegal immigrants to the U.S. economy far, far, far, far outweighs any burden they put on our medical system. #3 is a significant problem but isn't a reason to stop people from coming here. Geez, there are jobs, there are driven people - open the gates, make it legal, let these folks organize in the sunshine to get a decent wage. Xenophobes miss the fact that allowing more immigration has the potential to raise wages - legal workers tend to be more demanding than ones that can be deported.
DrAwkward wrote:If SKID ROW likes them enough to take them on tour, they must have something going on, right?

Illegal Immigration?

14 by johnnyemphysema_Archive
I have this debate with my father whenever he comes to visit, Thanksgiving happened to be one of these times. He is of the Lou Dobbs mindset that immigration sucks the lifeblood of the economy, I am the exact opposite. While I agree that the issue of immigration needs to be addressed I don't agree that it is the people crossing our border's fault. If the government i.e. republicans wanted to enact true reform they would go after the businesses that employ so called "illegals." I don't buy the arguement that "these people" are doing the jobs that we don't want, we want them, we just aren't going to do them for the shit assed pay that the companies want to pay. Also, I don't even see how this has become an issue except to distract us. Aren't there any pregnant white women being murdered or missing?

Illegal Immigration?

18 by Steve V_Archive
MrFood wrote:
Propagandhi wrote:Is this life? To stand here and wait. In this city forged of scraps. Is this life? To stand on the dead. On feces and sweat. Is this life? It’s all starting again. Quick, gather your belongings and go. Run while it’s still dark. Out here you’re as good as dead. Leave the shots echoing behind. Don’t look back until you run out of land. When you think there’s a second that you can’t be seen, the current can decide how this night will end. Don’t try to imagine what’s ahead. Let nothing cripple your will. You will cross enormous distance only to arrive with nothing. You will give all you have. If you navigate your way with endurance and success, if you pass the obstacles and still have your life, if you’ve escaped death, if your guts haven’t withered away, if you haven’t broken under the strain. They won’t be welcoming. They forget a time when their land was swelling. A monstrous movement across the sea. When she relieved her bowels all over the world. Don’t try to imagine what’s ahead. Let nothing cripple your will. Just follow the paths that they cut into the earth right back to their door.


Propagandhi also wrote wrote:A friend of mine dropped me a line, it said, "man, I gotta run to the USA. I got no money, got no job." She skipped out of Mexico to stay alive. You've got a problem with her living here, but what did you do to help her before she fucking came? What did the country do? What did the people do? I stand not by my country, but by people of the whole fucking world. No fences, no borders. Free movement for all. Fuck the border. It's about fucking time to treat people with respect. It's our culture and consumption that makes her life unbearable. Fuck this country; its angry eyes, its knee-jerk hordes. Legal or illegal, watch her fucking go. She'll take what's hers. Watch her fucking go. Fuck the border.

Illegal Immigration?

19 by beloveless_Archive
NO
I believe there is a legitimate pathway towards citizenship and if one chooses to subvert it they should go home. I don't want to pay for you or your kids wear and tear unless you are contributing towards it as well (you pay taxes and such). I know plenty of skilled laborers who's throats are getting cut by cheap import labor especially in the construction industry. American high steel and concrete guys have mouths to feed too and they can't do it when some jerk hires illegals at seven bucks an hour (if that).

UNLESS
We officially recognize, regulate and refine what already is ...
A servant/labor sub- class that is entitled to less rights and privileges as the citizenry. We get maximum labor benefit BEYOND what it costs us in earnings and limit available work to menial labor. , they get to eat and a place to sleep and their kids get to use our schools and health care. NO voting rights, no property, no wage control, No complaints, you can be kicked out at any moment an will be for any sort of felony activity.
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