I'm kind of gunshy pulling the trigger on some acoustic treatments.
Basically, I have a 20'x8' room, with about 8' height. I have mixing monitors ported in the front. My studio is almost entirely all line-in, only mics used are for vocals, maybe acoustic guitar.
So, I was thinking of doing the following:
- two-to-three 4'x2'x4" acoustic panels on the wall behind the monitors
- corner foam bass traps for the corners
- acoustic blankets on the walls to the side of the mixing desk
- 2" foam for the ceiling above the mixing desk
- 2" foam on the wall on the other side of the room
I was looking at blankets, they seem better in some ways than foam, in some cases cheaper on area of coverage.
I keep flipping back and forth about 2" and 4" on the panels, but from what I understand 4" for bass, 2" for first reflections. Anyway, I would love to hear some thoughts and advice before pulling the trigger. It's gonna cost a bit, but will be totally worth it. I would like to add that right now, with bare walls, it's really not that bad. I feel anything at this point would be an upgrade.
Re: Acoustic Treatment
2sounds like a rabbit hole is calling you.
idk but measurement or something should come into play so you can gauge incremental improvements, there are specific issues that can be resolved once identified
make a bunch of gobos so you have options--maybe some rigging points up high to stabilize stacked gobos.
idk but measurement or something should come into play so you can gauge incremental improvements, there are specific issues that can be resolved once identified
make a bunch of gobos so you have options--maybe some rigging points up high to stabilize stacked gobos.
Re: Acoustic Treatment
3I'll show you what I have done and am open to any suggestions as I have just added shit as I went to try to adjust for shit that bothers me.
I'm in a basement and have a weird recessed ledge right behind my desk and monitors. I've tried to completely deaden this area as much as possible. First I built a 7'X2.5'X10" trap covered in burlap and stuffed with pink insolation. It is open in back and front and sits about 8" from the wall. I also added 2 corner traps that are constructed out of peg board and faced with cheap foam, they are also stuffed with R13 or something, and open in the back. I trimmed every other surface up here with cheapo foam from Amazon. You can get like 60 square feet of that shit for around $70. It is NOT as good as the name brand stuff at all, but does deanen flutter reflections pretty well. All of this was very effective. Its a total dead zone up there now. The painting of Heather in the back of a truck with dead deer does definitely have a bit of a splash that I can tell is there, but it looks cool, so what ever.
A little foam on the sides to kill some flutter. The space is only 8' wide and the walls are way too close to my ears. It helped... a little? I'm probably going to build a couple of 4'X3'X4" cloth covered absorbers for each side of my head.
The most successful thing in here is this giant 6'X3'X10" deep absorber that sits along this weird diagonal brick section of wall that runs directly behind my right ear. It used to make everything feel like it was pulling to the right. It's open in the back and sits away from the wall about 4". Just made of pine board and stuffed with pink insolation. It also did very good things for a huge lobe of 80 Hz that I get if I listen too loud. Tolerable now. Bedsheets from thrift stores is a good way to get big pieces of fabric to cover these things for super cheap.
Another trap the same size in the live room up in the ledge space.
This is the only window to the outside world and it sits directly across from drum land. We are about tits deep in the basement so plugging this hole killed most of the bothersome outdoor sound. The window is plugged by double thick 3/4" drywall, sealed with caulk and then covered by this absorber that is stuffed with pink shit. If I'm standing in the driveway, I can barely hear the drums at all, and no one has ever complained.
Other than that, I have a bunch of panels like this made out of cheap "Audio" foam that don't really do very much of anything. some on the ceiling, some on walls. You can tell when they aren't there, but it's minor. This Amazon stuff is cheap and covers a lot of area but if I hold up a piece of it and a piece of auralex you can feel in your hands the difference in density and if you hold it to your ear, its a huge difference. The only panels I have that are made of real foam are above the drums, and above my mix position, oh, and on the door behind my mix position. The actually do some work, and I wouldn't suggest buying that cheap stuff from Amazon if you need heavy absorption.
That's basically all I have done. The pink stuff absorbers are pretty cheap to build and work really well. Foam is mostly a waste of time if you don't shell out for the good stuff.
I'm in a basement and have a weird recessed ledge right behind my desk and monitors. I've tried to completely deaden this area as much as possible. First I built a 7'X2.5'X10" trap covered in burlap and stuffed with pink insolation. It is open in back and front and sits about 8" from the wall. I also added 2 corner traps that are constructed out of peg board and faced with cheap foam, they are also stuffed with R13 or something, and open in the back. I trimmed every other surface up here with cheapo foam from Amazon. You can get like 60 square feet of that shit for around $70. It is NOT as good as the name brand stuff at all, but does deanen flutter reflections pretty well. All of this was very effective. Its a total dead zone up there now. The painting of Heather in the back of a truck with dead deer does definitely have a bit of a splash that I can tell is there, but it looks cool, so what ever.
A little foam on the sides to kill some flutter. The space is only 8' wide and the walls are way too close to my ears. It helped... a little? I'm probably going to build a couple of 4'X3'X4" cloth covered absorbers for each side of my head.
The most successful thing in here is this giant 6'X3'X10" deep absorber that sits along this weird diagonal brick section of wall that runs directly behind my right ear. It used to make everything feel like it was pulling to the right. It's open in the back and sits away from the wall about 4". Just made of pine board and stuffed with pink insolation. It also did very good things for a huge lobe of 80 Hz that I get if I listen too loud. Tolerable now. Bedsheets from thrift stores is a good way to get big pieces of fabric to cover these things for super cheap.
Another trap the same size in the live room up in the ledge space.
This is the only window to the outside world and it sits directly across from drum land. We are about tits deep in the basement so plugging this hole killed most of the bothersome outdoor sound. The window is plugged by double thick 3/4" drywall, sealed with caulk and then covered by this absorber that is stuffed with pink shit. If I'm standing in the driveway, I can barely hear the drums at all, and no one has ever complained.
Other than that, I have a bunch of panels like this made out of cheap "Audio" foam that don't really do very much of anything. some on the ceiling, some on walls. You can tell when they aren't there, but it's minor. This Amazon stuff is cheap and covers a lot of area but if I hold up a piece of it and a piece of auralex you can feel in your hands the difference in density and if you hold it to your ear, its a huge difference. The only panels I have that are made of real foam are above the drums, and above my mix position, oh, and on the door behind my mix position. The actually do some work, and I wouldn't suggest buying that cheap stuff from Amazon if you need heavy absorption.
That's basically all I have done. The pink stuff absorbers are pretty cheap to build and work really well. Foam is mostly a waste of time if you don't shell out for the good stuff.
Last edited by Kniferide on Thu Sep 30, 2021 5:43 pm, edited 3 times in total.
Re: Acoustic Treatment
4Yeah, insulation is better than foam. Panels made of rigid fiberglass (the famed OC703 or the John Manville equivalent) works better for cheaper than some of the products.
If you really wanna tame bass you gotta go thicker than 4 inches. 6 helps, but to really grab the boomy stuff takes more than 8.
If you're worried about making it too dry, or dark, pegboard construction glued to rigid fiberglass tames some mid frequency modes and still allows some reflection to happen.
As far as how all of the pieces come together, that's a rubix cube dropped on a chess board. Measurement is cool, and it's the only way to really mark a path, but it's a goddamn rabbit hole. Some general improvements can be made without it. Listening for uneven response in the room with various bass synth notes (or bass guitar), listening for flutter echo by walking around clicking claves, or drum sticks etc.
If you really wanna tame bass you gotta go thicker than 4 inches. 6 helps, but to really grab the boomy stuff takes more than 8.
If you're worried about making it too dry, or dark, pegboard construction glued to rigid fiberglass tames some mid frequency modes and still allows some reflection to happen.
As far as how all of the pieces come together, that's a rubix cube dropped on a chess board. Measurement is cool, and it's the only way to really mark a path, but it's a goddamn rabbit hole. Some general improvements can be made without it. Listening for uneven response in the room with various bass synth notes (or bass guitar), listening for flutter echo by walking around clicking claves, or drum sticks etc.
Re: Acoustic Treatment
5I don't find bass to be an issue, though. I specifically bought front-ported speakers because I wasn't sure if I was going to have enough space behind the monitors to make it work. The monitors though, are pretty flat and don't over-emphasis the bass. I would just put foam around the whole mixing area, but it's not that much of a save on money, so I figured I'd try to do it better. I think this area could probably use the acoustic panels more than the rest, but that's just my uneducated opinion.
Here's the desk area:
Here's the main wall, where amps are, not to concerned with it, maybe just above could use something. I don't find the window to be an issue, but that is something that could be addressed later if it does become one.
The opposite side is where the door to the room is. I was thinking of using an isolation blanket there to drop when the door is closed, otherwise have it rolled up. Behind the drums I would probably just do foam for the far reflections.
Another thing is the air duct that cuts right above. I was thinking of using foam on the bottom of it, with the foam on the ceiling above around the desk.
The last idea I have is creating a make-shift vocal booth out of isolation blankets and hang them up around the mics from the ceiling. That way I can take them down when not recording vocals and not have to worry about space.
Here's the desk area:
Here's the main wall, where amps are, not to concerned with it, maybe just above could use something. I don't find the window to be an issue, but that is something that could be addressed later if it does become one.
The opposite side is where the door to the room is. I was thinking of using an isolation blanket there to drop when the door is closed, otherwise have it rolled up. Behind the drums I would probably just do foam for the far reflections.
Another thing is the air duct that cuts right above. I was thinking of using foam on the bottom of it, with the foam on the ceiling above around the desk.
The last idea I have is creating a make-shift vocal booth out of isolation blankets and hang them up around the mics from the ceiling. That way I can take them down when not recording vocals and not have to worry about space.
Re: Acoustic Treatment
6Just FYI - none of these images show for me. If I visit the URLs directly, I'm asked to log into an MS/Live account.
Re: Acoustic Treatment
7Don't use foam. Straight up. Waste of time and money. Use insulation. Your choices are:
Owens Corning 703 or the Johns Manville equivalent (used to be 814 I dunno what it is now)
Rockwool
Pink fluffy
You can buy premade panels from GIK or the like, those are all going to be 703. If you have more money than time, do that. If you're jamming econo then these are easy to DIY.
Rockwool is going to be cheaper than 703, unfortunately it's also a lot messier to work with, and you'll have to make frames. 703 boards are rigid, you can just cover them.
Don't bother with 2" panels, just go 4" at least. Go as thick as you can in all 4 corners, floor to ceiling. That's where the low end collects.
Those small monitors aren't going to be putting out much below ~60hz, which is actually to your advantage, as those real low freqs are by far the hardest to deal with. If you're in a normal house/apartment, the walls are thin enough that a lot of low end will just go right through them, which is also to your advantage, although your spouse/roommates might not agree.
For serious bass trapping you're talking feet not inches, and for that, less dense insulation works better, which is counter-intuitive but true. The front and back of my mastering studio are ~3' of pink fluffy, floor to ceiling. I'm not saying you need to do that in your space! I'm.....just saying.
Anyway, thick as possible in the corners, panels at first reflection points on the side walls (use a mirror and a friend to find them), panels on the ceiling over your monitors/desk/chair.
If you're super serious, then a program like Room Eq Wizard is essential for seeing what's happening in your room and what the treatments are actually doing, but it will be a mega deep rabbit hole. Very rewarding when you finally climb out, but it'll take some time and definitely won't be the most fun you've ever had.
Owens Corning 703 or the Johns Manville equivalent (used to be 814 I dunno what it is now)
Rockwool
Pink fluffy
You can buy premade panels from GIK or the like, those are all going to be 703. If you have more money than time, do that. If you're jamming econo then these are easy to DIY.
Rockwool is going to be cheaper than 703, unfortunately it's also a lot messier to work with, and you'll have to make frames. 703 boards are rigid, you can just cover them.
Don't bother with 2" panels, just go 4" at least. Go as thick as you can in all 4 corners, floor to ceiling. That's where the low end collects.
Those small monitors aren't going to be putting out much below ~60hz, which is actually to your advantage, as those real low freqs are by far the hardest to deal with. If you're in a normal house/apartment, the walls are thin enough that a lot of low end will just go right through them, which is also to your advantage, although your spouse/roommates might not agree.
For serious bass trapping you're talking feet not inches, and for that, less dense insulation works better, which is counter-intuitive but true. The front and back of my mastering studio are ~3' of pink fluffy, floor to ceiling. I'm not saying you need to do that in your space! I'm.....just saying.
Anyway, thick as possible in the corners, panels at first reflection points on the side walls (use a mirror and a friend to find them), panels on the ceiling over your monitors/desk/chair.
If you're super serious, then a program like Room Eq Wizard is essential for seeing what's happening in your room and what the treatments are actually doing, but it will be a mega deep rabbit hole. Very rewarding when you finally climb out, but it'll take some time and definitely won't be the most fun you've ever had.
Re: Acoustic Treatment
9Mass-air-mass for absorption where you can. Looks like you’re somewhat strapped for extra space there. Granted that’s more for isolation than taming reflections.
Re: Acoustic Treatment
10Fixed... I think.brephophagist wrote: Thu Sep 30, 2021 10:44 amJust FYI - none of these images show for me. If I visit the URLs directly, I'm asked to log into an MS/Live account.